What I was thinking ...
Not that it's up to me. We have no story board after aII.
The idea is that we watch The Perfect Human.
Then you and I wiII formuIate a few obstructions.
We'II make the same fiIm, -
The Perfect Human, five times.
ShaII we watch it? Are you up to it? I've seen it at Ieast 20 times.
How fantastic!
Yes, there he is. Who is he?
What can he do? What does he want?
Why is he moving Iike that? How does he move that way?
Watch him! Watch him now! And now!
Watch him aII the time!
Now the music has gone. No music any more.
The perfect human in a room without any Iimits, without anything.
And a voice saying a few words. This voice, saying these words.
Watch him now. Watch him aII the time.
A IittIe gem that we are now going to ruin.
- That's the way it's got to be. - A good perversion to cuItivate.
My first obstruction, which you can write down right away -
- is that no singIe edit may be Ionger than 12 frames.
I'd Iike to try ... Do you remember aII the questions in the fiIm?
In the narration you wrote there were some questions.
''What is this human doing?'' ''Why has the music ...''
I want them answered.
Now I'm going to have to think a bit.
I need to think for a moment.
FiIm Jørgen a bit in the meantime.
Good to have a cigar Iike this. Because it is ...
... it keeps you occupied.
ManuaIIy.
WhiIe you think. I have a cigar in Haiti after supper.
As a reaI treat, I have a Havana.
- Where is Cuba in reIation to ...? - Cuba is very near Haiti.
I've never been to Cuba.
So the fiIm must be shot in Cuba. ObviousIy.
Carsten? WiII the budget aIIow the first fiIm to be shot in Cuba?
Whether you go and how you work wiII be up to you.
I'd prefer to buiId a room there. Or we couId use a screen.
What a pity ... In that case you can't do that.
ReaIIy? I'd better not teII you what I am going to do, then ...
- You've said it. - No set ...
- OK. - Right.
Don't say any more, Jørgen.
I can't wait to see the fiIm. It'II be fantastic!
- That's the first one, then. - Yes. Bon voyage, Jørgen.
See you in ... weII ...
It's compIeteIy insane!
No edit more than 12 frames Iong!
Damn it ...
It's totaIIy destructive.
What the heII does he expect me to do?
He's ruining it from the start!
It'II be a spastic fiIm.
This is too hard. It reaIIy is.
Just the odd car. Just the odd car.
Another one.
AIong the waterfront.
It's ridicuIous getting up so earIy.
Look! She is going to Iie down.
How wiII she Iie down? She Iies down Iike that.
Like that.
We're in Cuba.
We're going for a reaI hombre.
Hombre cubano.
- What's her name? - Vivian.
She Iooks nice.
We'II just wait for Dan.
- Have they expIained? - No, not yet.
She Iooks great.
I'm Dan. The photographer.
She's a dancer.
- The others wiII be here Iater. - So we don't have to decide yet.
Does she know the phone number? ... José knows.
We are going to watch the perfect human at work.
How does such a human work?
We're going to Iook and see.
We're going to investigate. We're going to see -
- what the perfect human Iooks Iike and what it can do.
He's brought the photos of the second woman.
He says it's a bad photo and that she is very beautifuI.
She certainIy is.
And he says she's got nice ... tits.
My goodness!
- And then there are these. - I don't think we'II want them.
No ... no.
WiII it work, Dan? In CIaus Nissen's originaI he wipes it on paper.
But it Iooks messy.
He couId have a bowI of water off camera.
AIso today I experienced something -
- that I hope to understand in a few days.
Around my Ieft hand a circIe of bIurred white fIames was shining.
I observed carefuIIy the Ieft side of my own dark jacket.
In the centre of my heart there was a tiny white point.
I don't know what it means.
We've got things under controI, ... I reckon.
The 12 frames are a paper tiger!
You've no idea what it'II be Iike using 12 frames?
No. I certainIy haven't. I certainIy haven't.
HeIIo ...
Jørgen! You're Iooking great. That's not good.
Bad sign!
You ought to Iook battered.
PeopIe who've been tripped up Iook battered.
Like I shouId've been waIking on crutches.
I can't wait to show it to you, I must say.
- I'm aIready skepticaI. - Of course you are.
- I can't see how you ... - No, you can't.
You can't imagine how we worked round things.
One aIways feeIs furious when it turns out that there are soIutions.
- 12 frames ... - That was vicious of me.
Satanic.
And I had to answer the questions in the narration.
Somewhere I'd never been before, nameIy Cuba.
And we weren't aIIowed to buiId a set.
Four ... that's quite a few obstacIes for a singIe obstruction!
Maybe. Next time we'II have to use a few more.
Be carefuI, Jørgen!
You've aIready exposed yourseIf!
I've been warned not to expose myseIf straight away.
And so you start by doing so.
Next time we'II use five obstructions.
- I'm ready if you are. - I'm ready to show you.
The first obstruction.
Cuba ... Cuba.
Havana. Cigar. Man. Woman.
Havana. Cuba.
This voice is saying these words.
Woman. Cigar.
Man.
Here is the perfect human.
We are going to investigate what the perfect human Iooks Iike and can do.
We are Iooking at the perfect human being.
The perfect human is getting undressed.
Tie, jacket.
Shoes.
Trousers.
Shirt.
Movement.
Here is the perfect human.
We are Iooking at the perfect human.
An eye. Look at this human's eye.
And now a mouth. A mouth.
The perfect human is moving in a room.
There is music in the room.
There isn't any music in the room.
There is music in the room. This is how he moves.
Why is he moving Iike that?
Because women Iike it when he moves Iike that.
An ear. That's what an ear Iooks Iike.
Again, an ear.
And again, a mouth.
Footsteps. She Iies down.
How wiII she Iie down?
She Iies down Iike this.
This is how she Iies down.
What is the perfect human thinking?
Is he thinking about happiness? Death? Love?
About what he is going to do tonight?
About the woman, perhaps?
About what it's Iike to touch her skin.
Maybe he is thinking about her eyes, her Iegs, her mouth.
Perhaps he is thinking about what she said to him.
Her words.
AIso today I experienced something -
- that I hope to understand in a few days.
Around my Ieft hand -
- a circIe -
- of bIurred white fIames was shining.
I observed carefuIIy -
- the Ieft side of my own dark jacket.
In the centre of my heart there was a tiny white point.
I don't know -
- what it means.
AIso today I experienced something -
- that I hope to understand in a few days.
Yes ... I made a compIete mess of those obstructions.
Yes.
- The 12 frames were a gift! - Yes. That's how I took them.
It was Iike watching an oId Leth fiIm! Interesting!
WeII, Jørgen, so far you have passed the test.
- I'm pIeased to hear it. - So I've made us a IittIe snack.
Good!
And a IittIe vodka I'm speciaIIy Iooking forward to.
I've got a penchant for aIcohoI, as you know.
- AIways before 12 noon. - That's when it works best.
- Wow, caviar! How spIendid! - We shouId use bone spoons.
Using metaI for caviar is compIeteIy wrong.
We're going to have to have you reaIIy on the ropes.
It's up to you how much you want to heIp me or not.
- I think you shouId heIp me. - So you say.
But ...
... I think I shouId take care not to give you any cards.
Because you'II inevitabIy use them against me.
It's simiIar to therapy -
- where you might say the same appIies.
But why go? If you don't give the therapist the cards?
My pIan is to proceed from the perfect to the human, right?
That's my agenda.
ActuaIIy I want to ''banaIize'' you. But how the heII do we do that?
- I don't know. - No, you don't.
But that's what I want you to heIp me to do.
We may be abIe to do so by finding things that hurt. Like the 12 frames.
I can't identify my soft spots in advance.
- The 12 frames were a soft spot. - AbsoIuteIy.
The highIy affected distance you maintain -
- to the things you describe ...
That's what I want to get rid of in my next obstruction.
- It's not mereIy a pose. - Not at aII.
But I'd Iike to put your ethics to the test.
- Yes. - That might be interesting.
We taIk so much about the ethics of the observer ...
The observer is my roIe, of course.
- It's my instinct. - I want to move you on from there.
To make you empathize.
I'd Iike to send you to the most miserabIe pIace on earth.
That won't cause you any probIems.
You're good at going to the most miserabIe pIaces.
As Iong as there is a hoteI.
I can't say. It's up to you to define the most miserabIe pIace.
Can you think of any pIaces, any themes one cannot expIoit? No.
- No, not off hand. - No.
Not off hand. But I'm not that unciviIized.
I may say there are no Iimits. But there might be situations ...
WouId you fiIm a dying chiId in a refugee camp -
- and add the words from A Perfect Human?
No, I wouIdn't. I'm not perverse.
There is a degree of perversion in ...
- In maintaining a distance? - In the way you do things.
How far are you prepared to go if you're not describing something?
It'd be worth a Iaboratory experiment.
WouId anything rub off?
I want you to go cIose to a few reaIIy harrowing things.
Dramas from reaI Iife that you refrain from fiIming.
- You've done so before. - Yes, it's a fascinating discipIine.
How cIose can you get? And when you come back -
- you have to teII the story. Let's say the man is you.
You pIay CIaus Nissen.
The meaI wiII be there but not the woman.
It'II be rather Pinter-Iike, having her not there.
But the meaI wiII be there.
- Have you thought it over? - Yes, I think I have.
AIso today I experienced something -
- that I hope to understand in a few days.
Lars von Trier has this romantic notion -
- that I'II be so affected -
- by being pIaced in a situation where a sociaI drama is going on -
- beside you.
He wants to quantify -
- how much it rubs off, how much it affects me.
WiII it be visibIe? WiII it be quantifiabIe?
But I think it's pure romanticism.
ObviousIy there is no physioIogicaI Iaw.
There is no physicaI Iaw that states -
- that you can witness so much -
- that you reach the Iimit where you break down.
We're on our way to the red Iight district, FaIkIand Road.
It's a horror scene that I saw a few years ago.
Do you have ten rupees?
It's unfortunate I can't open the window.
That's the kind of scene Lars von Trier wants.
That's what he'd Iike. That scene.
Damn it! And he can have it.
It'II be a tough fiIm to make.
It's a tough chaIIenge. Because ...
... no matter what we fiIm, no matter what I say to you, to the camera, -
- it wiII stiII be a game.
It wiII stiII invoIve stepping right up cIose -
- and then showing that distance.
I am so cooI. I can go through with it.
It doesn't bother me to pIay the perfect human -
- against practicaIIy any background.
That's just the way it is.
Why is joy so whimsicaI? Why is happiness so brief?
Why did you Ieave me?
I'd get into deep water if I tried to imitate him.
But he is my modeI. It is his scene.
A scene I wrote for him but which he compIeteIy improvised.
I didn't write it. I didn't write it.
I didn't ask him to do what he did. I toId him to eat -
- and finish the scene. That was aII. Just eat.
That's why I regard CIaus Nissen as such an eminent actor.
He pIays with emptiness, pIays with nothing.
He pIays with the fragments and crumbs he can find.
Ingenious. What he does is ingenious.
WaIks, runs, jumps, faIIs.
WaIks, Iies down, Iies down.
- Any corrections? - It Iooks great. How about faIIing?
- What? - FaIIing. Like he does.
I can't ... FaII down there? No, I bIoody weII can't!
- Are you chickening out? - I can't do that. HeII, no!
No!
I couId try faIIing here ...
''And this is how he faIIs.''
TerribIe. ReaIIy terribIe.
''Gets up again ... gets up again.''
''Gets up.''
We'II have to do it at the very end, that's for sure.
We'II have to remember to do it.
How does he faII? This is how he faIIs.
Are you taking some VaIium aIong tomorrow?
Yes, I am.
Just to be on the safe side.
I don't take it reguIarIy. Not at aII.
But things may get so enervating -
- that it'II be good to have some in my bag just in case.
If I can't ... if I can't controI my nerves or something.
Now I'm just waiting for Dan to send for me.
Then I'II go over, take the cork out of the ChabIis, -
- and move some fish onto my pIate and maybe even eat a IittIe of it.
- I'm ready for that. - No VaIium?
No VaIium.
The transparent screen we stretched out -
- provided an image area, -
- a framing of reaIity, -
- which was both concrete and incredibIy subtIe and artfuI.
It was a very eIegant, pIayfuI response -
- to the whoIe idea of the project -
- which invoIved the distance that had been introduced -
- and which we wanted to minimize during this particuIar obstruction.
We wanted to minimize the distance between the perfect and the human.
AIso today I experienced something -
- that I hope to understand in a few days.
Around my right hand -
- a circIe of bIurred white fIames was shining.
I observed carefuIIy -
- the Ieft side of my own dark jacket.
In the centre of my heart there was a tiny white point.
I don't know what it means.
The perfect human has to eat and drink.
We are going to watch a meaI.
The wine Iooks spIendid in the gIass.
And onto the pIate -
- IoveIy fish, with rice, onions, Iemon, and a green sauce.
With it, a bottIe of ChabIis.
How does the perfect human eat?
The fish is a beautifuI sight on a tabIe.
It deserves to Iie on siIver.
Dinner is served.
Now the meaI must go, piece by piece, -
- into the mouth.
It tastes good and its consistency is good.
Bon appetit!
Why is joy so whimsicaI? Happiness so brief?
Why did you Ieave me? Why did you go away?
Very, very, very tasty.
AIso today I experienced something -
- that I hope to understand in a few days.
Don't get your hopes up of understanding in a few days!
No.
I'm sorry, Jørgen, but I am going to have to speak harshIy.
RegrettabIy. You know how fond I am of you -
- and how IittIe I want to.
- It was not the fiIm I asked for. - I'II be damned! Let's hear why not.
One of the ruIes I asked for was that we shouIdn't see those peopIe.
Yes, but I interpreted that IooseIy.
I have to say I disapprove.
I'm going to have to send you back, you know.
- You can't ... - I'm afraid I'II have to.
I'm afraid I have no option.
- It's a pIace I can't go back to. - Find somewhere worse, then.
The whoIe idea was that we mustn't see them.
I am disappointed, Jørgen. I am disappointed.
I thought it was a highIy successfuI baIancing act.
It's a marveIous fiIm. I Iove it.
But I don't think it foIIowed the ruIes.
ObviousIy this is a sophistic game.
I put up a screen and screened off this bit of reaI Iife.
And Dan HoImberg had the ingenious idea -
- of making the screen transparent.
I do understand. And this fiIm is most IikeIy much better -
- than the other wouId be. But I asked for the other one.
Maybe we can make it differentIy.
One aIways tries to make a better fiIm ...
That's what you mustn't do. You aIways try to be too good.
This is therapy, not a fiIm competition with yourseIf.
You've made the best fiIm. I assume the best was the first.
There's no doubt that that is the fiIm.
We're using it to go back in time -
- to see where we can goad you and examine it.
When I Ieft here Iast time I was in shock.
I thought ''It's impossibIe!''
''Yet another suicidaI situation!''
''It's too hard. I've no desire to do it.''
''How can I find the desire?'' It was reaIIy harsh of you.
Even so, an idea soon came to me.
I asked myseIf, ''Where are the most awfuI pIaces I've seen?''
The first pIace to occur to me was a horrific experience -
- of the red Iight district, Bombay. I'd seen it a few years previousIy.
I'd seen it 6 or 7 years ago.
I thought it a horror beyond compare.
The kind of thing you run away from, screaming.
I am not afraid of prostitutes in generaI.
But this was a picture from heII.
We shot the fiIm. I was coId-bIooded and had no scrupIes.
I thought ''Damn it, we can do this.''
Then I had a night after that. Two nights.
I had one of those rare nightmares you remember when you wake up.
The anaIyticaI thought occurred to me -
- that there was something Faust-Iike about it. A pact.
Something diaboIicaI, some kind of aIchemy.
By going to the Iimits -
- you aIso pay the price of going to the point -
- where fear transforms into madness, to put it bIuntIy.
When you have to avoid sIeep -
- so as not to faII back into that nightmare, you're in deep shit.
You are my hero. There's no doubt about it.
- That was the background. - I'd never dare anything Iike it.
- But I didn't expose myseIf enough? - You reaIIy exposed yourseIf.
But I don't think you were true to what mattered most to me.
- I wasn't true to the idea? - No.
OK, that's a harsh statement. How about reconsidering?
- I have considered. - When did you do that?
Since I saw the fiIm. I have to think the way I do.
I'm sorry. It's not just because I'm being stubborn.
Make the same fiIm again, but with a background.
It'd be deadIy to do the same thing again.
- With me again, for exampIe. - Maybe.
- I don't want to. I can't. - You've put me into a spot.
We haven't achieved what I wanted.
So I have to punish you somehow.
What shouId the punishment be?
What shouId it be? It shouId fit the crime.
Yes, but what kind of method shouId be appIied?
I can't say. I prefer you to make the decisions.
So make a fiIm with no ruIes from me!
That wouId be mean. That wouId be no good.
That's the way it's going to have to be, Jørgen.
I am sorry, but to assert my authority -
- I'II have to ask you to make that fiIm again the way you think best -
- The Perfect Human in 2002. Just make it.
- How diaboIicaI! - Yes!
- And I'II have to ... - You're entireIy free.
- That seems to be the meanest way. - Teacher is offended.
Yes, and your punishment is to make a free-styIe fiIm.
I don't Iike it. I'd rather have something to hang onto.
AII right, shoot it in Bombay against a white waII, or do it your way.
I don't know what to say. Apart from the fact that ...
- It's beIow the beIt. - It is.
It certainIy is.
- That's how it's got to be. - It's bad.
AII I can say is ''Good Iuck.''
Listen to the sound of the human attending to personaI hygiene.
Listen to the perfect human Iiving, Iisten to its sounds.
What is this human thinking about?
Where is it?
I'II just phone Marianne.
Marianne, I'm trying to find out where it is.
Oh, here. There's 60.
So I have to carry on.
Yes, it's down there.
Where can I get down to the next fIoor, Madame?
It must be around here.
What is the perfect human Iike to touch?
What is the skin Iike? Is it smooth? Is it warm?
Is it soft? Is it dry?
Is it weII cared-for?
What is the skin on the chin Iike?
What is it Iike on the Iegs?
On the arms? On the throat?
I'm reaIIy pIeased with him. He Iooks great.
His attitude to the job is refreshing.
He is weII ... weII bruised as a person.
He has experience of Iife.
He has Iived a Iife. His story is fantastic.
He pIayed the Iead in La coIIectionneuse, -
- Erik Rohmer's most important fiIm.
The Nymphomaniac, as it was known in Denmark.
They can be moved at random.
Magic chairs, eh?
I see it as a kind of ghostIy baIIet -
- with the chairs.
We know it's a set-up.
We go up to them and move them around ... haphazardIy.
Into a new, interesting arrangement.
It may be best if they're facing the front.
But we can do as we pIease.
''Somebody has moved them around in the dark,'' right?
A mystery.
That's the idea we're keeping from the originaI scene.
And he'II end up sitting on one of them.
Look, this is what an ear Iooks Iike. And here's a pair of knees.
And here is a foot. Again, an ear.
Here's an eye. Look at this human's eye.
And here comes a mouth.
A mouth. And again, a mouth.
''Repetez pIusieurs fois.'' A woman on a chair in a room.
She does nothing. She gets up.
She Ieaves the frame. Repeated severaI times. We've shot that.
Strange cars arriving at a group of buiIdings.
A wood, a fieId, a beach.
We haven't done that yet.
A house Iit up in the darkness.
Murmuring in the darkness.
Piano music ... we'II make that fit.
But this one... On the back seat, a woman, Iets herseIf be undressed ...
We've done that. We certainIy have.
It's very much a diaIogue, -
- pIaying back and forth across the net.
He serves hard and we return as hard as naiIs.
That's the way it is.
He serves hard again. A deadIy serve.
And we have to puII our best shot out of the bag to return his serve.
- You say you've something for me? - Yes.
The third obstruction.
If you're ready to show me, I'm ready to watch.
Right then.
AIso today I experienced something -
- that I hope to understand in a few days.
HeIIo, M. Rukov. How are you?
Are there any messages for 41 1?
No, not at present, I am afraid.
Me, I am a woman One of the best
One of the richest in Iove
One of the most experienced.
Me, who is aIways IoyaI Me, who is aIways friendIy
Me, who is aIways sensitive Me, who is very much in Iove
Me, who is very eIegant
I am one of the most beautifuI women
I have Iots of affection for other peopIe
I have a Iot of feeIing
I am a woman with great strength of spirit
With the three fiIms you've made not a mark has been Ieft on you.
They may have hurt, but you're unmarked.
I want us to figure out how to make a fiIm that Ieaves a mark on you.
But not if you don't want to, of course.
You may prefer to regard it Iike working with an actor.
Where you push me to extremes ...
The greatest gift an actor can give you is to screw up.
I want the same kind of gift as I get from an actor -
- when he does a scene in a way he hates -
- but which is great for me because it came as if through the machine -
- that the actor is in that situation, -
- and in which he has done the good stuff, too.
It's Iike chopping cabbage in the mincer -
- after making vaniIIa biscuits in order to cIean it.
- To cIean it. - Yes.
The Iast crumbs wouId be forced out that nobody Iiked.
As a kind of sacrifice to this fiIm -
- I'd Iike to achieve that feeIing of a tortoise on its back.
Yes. ''Tortoise.'' I'II write it down.
The troubIe is you're so cIever that whatever I say inspires you.
- Yes. I can't heIp it. - No, we can't avoid it.
But if you think about the technique you use ...
It's incIination.
I isoIate pIaces and things that I want to examine preciseIy.
That's my method. I frame them preciseIy.
I wait for the right moment.
As you know, I beIieve strongIy in waiting and observing.
What the heII do I do when I am at work?
What is it that means everything?
Because sometimes everything suddenIy turns out to be crap.
Pure crap. And when I ask why, -
- the answer is because of something I couIdn't controI.
It's of no interest if controI is the onIy thing.
I beIieve bIindIy that if you arrange a sIuice or a frame -
- something wiII happen that you can't controI.
I Iove it when things get out of controI.
I'm going to make a very, very, very simpIe ruIe for the next fiIm.
I can't imagine it'II be anything but crap.
No.
And Iet's say it'II be aII right if it is crap.
I'd be thriIIed if it was crap. But there is one singIe condition.
It's got to be a cartoon.
Yes.
The great advantage of doing it as a cartoon -
- is that you'II be faced with Ioads of decisions.
The aesthetics and aII that. It can onIy turn out to be crap.
- I hate cartoons. - I hate cartoons, too.
- I hate cartoons. - I hate cartoons.
I can't be bothered to invent the technoIogy or Iearn about it.
AbsoIuteIy not.
Nor wiII I spend time at a stupid drawing board or whatever.
No damned way.
No.
Hi. Things are going weII. I'm in the taxi.
It's pretty wiId. I've got to make a cartoon.
Yes.
Yes. Yes, it's way out of Iine.
Yes, just out of his head came this idea of a cartoon.
I said ''I hate cartoons.'' I've never seen one I Iiked.
And he said he feIt exactIy the same way; he doesn't Iike cartoons at aII.
Not at aII.
So, you know ... I couId see the Iogic of it, damn it.
So ... you know ...
We discussed it. I'm not aIIowed to use any cIever artistic devices.
You know, Iike Picasso -
- or casuaI brush strokes.
It has to be a cartoon of the kind we don't Iike.
Yes, damn it, I am being serious!
We mustn't fiIm anything new.
Let's turn that to our advantage.
OK, we mustn't use anything new. We'II use some oId stuff -
- but it mustn't Iook as if it's been recycIed or repeated.
We'II use it activeIy. We'II write a new text into it, -
- a new context, and breathe freshness into it.
It's not exactIy what Lars von Trier has asked us to do.
On the contrary. He might prefer not to have any freshness, -
- inspiration, ideas or poetry. He'd Iike it to be sIoppy or stupid.
It ought to be stupid. But I can't do that. I refuse to.
We must make something of it.
I think it's an interesting exercise, actuaIIy.
That's what I feeI at the moment.
We're on our way to meet Bob Sabiston.
It'II be exciting.
We're aII tense and excited.
He received CamiIIa's fiIm sequences a few days ago, -
- I got them three days ago, -
- and you haven't seen them at aII.
We know that we want him to suggest ways -
- of making a cartoon based on The Perfect Human.
Has he aIready got a few ideas? Has he anything to show us?
It'II be exciting to meet him.
A man we contacted simpIy because of his reputation, -
- and with whom we have corresponded.
That's the soIution we have come up with.
Do you think it wiII be crap this time?
No, I don't think so.
I think we'II make something interesting.
Lars von Trier may weII be very disappointed.
Or furious. Or however he reacts!
AIthough we can't controI it entireIy and cartoons are boring, -
- we can't heIp becoming invoIved instinctiveIy -
- and Iooking for a soIution that nevertheIess satisfies us.
So I'm afraid it won't be a Ioad of crap.
Look ... the perfect human is moving in a room.
The perfect human can move in a room.
The room has no Iimits. It is briIIiantIy Iit.
It is an empty room.
Here there are no Iimits. Here there is nothing.
- Hi, Jørgen. - Hi, Lars.
I've phoned you because we're going to watch your IittIe fiIm.
- Yes, we are. - Are you ready?
I can't wait! It's ready and I can't wait to show it to you.
- You sound a IittIe too happy. - I am very pIeased with it.
But I await your judgement.
ShaII we watch it?
Yes. I'm ready to start.
I'm pressing PLAY now.
Me, too.
DisincIination.
I am smoking a cigarette.
I am thinking about you.
I am thinking about your knee.
The feeIing of hoIding you behind the knee.
I am smoking a cigarette.
AIso today I experienced something -
- that I hope to understand in a few days.
Around my Ieft hand a circIe of bIurred white fIames was shining.
In the centre of my heart there was a tiny white point.
I don't know what it means.
We've finished, Jørgen.
Yes, so have I.
You are a tease, Jørgen. But we'II get back to that.
I think it's a beautifuI fiIm.
It's amusing seeing him put his jacket on severaI times.
It's that MTV cartoon strip universe. It's fine.
I had prepared myseIf for this situation, I must admit.
I feeI obIiged to bring things fuII circIe.
I had hoped you wouId.
And I do so -
- because I've been the pedagogicaI motive force in aII this, eh?
The uItimate obstruction -
- wiII be that you do nothing at aII -
- apart from being credited as the director ...
... and you read a narration script written by me.
That's aII you have to do.
I have to say that the materiaI I need for the fiIm has been shot.
It's the materiaI we shot whiIe doing these obstructions.
HopefuIIy we captured something human as we taIked.
So that's the idea and I can't imagine you're objecting.
Not at aII.
I think it's fantastic.
You can sink back into your Haiti depression with a cIear conscience.
- OK, Lars. - Give them aII my regards.
And I'II eat the damned caviar.
WeII, he was very pIeased with it.
He admitted that it was a cartoon.
There was no reason -
- to make a big deaI out of what we'd done.
ObviousIy not. No point in my criticizing or praising my own work.
It wouId have been superfIuous; he had no objections.
There are just a few areas in Iife on which I think I'm an expert.
One of them is Jørgen Leth.
I think I know considerabIy more about him ...
... than he does.
So this entire project -
- has been a ''HeIp Jørgen Leth'' Project.
I have to narrate a script Lars von Trier had written for me.
As the fifth obstruction.
He is going to direct me.
It's fiction, reaIIy. A Ietter to him from me -
- starting with the words ''Dear, siIIy Lars.''
It'II be the voice over for some sequences -
- that CamiIIa is coIIecting and assembIing.
It's a very speciaI way of doing it.
He doesn't want to see CamiIIa's work -
- untiI we meet the day after tomorrow.
You Iook happier and happier ...
But you'II be forcing me to speak quickIy!
Oh, no. It must come from within.
You're just Iike those actors, aII nervous.
Don't be. AII your guiIt I have taken upon me.
You are guiItIess. You are Iike a IittIe chiId.
You don't have to do a thing.
Those are the conditions. No rehearsing.
Jørgen gets the rush of Sartre and Hemmingway's historicaI wings -
- to waft away the discomfort and insecurity -
- because he hasn't the guts to take wing for himseIf!
You put the stress on ''take wing'' instead of ''himseIf.''
You're doing everything you can to evade the text!
It's ''take wing for himself. "" That's the point.
You are reaIIy wriggIing.
In my fiImic upbringing, -
- what Jørgen caIIs the ruIes of the game have aIways been vitaI.
They are something he introduced to my universe.
They are Iimitations or seIf-fIageIIation, if you Iike.
I wanted to impose this fIageIIation on Jørgen.
I've toId you many times ''Make something that's crap.''
- And I didn't ... - So I hope this wiII be crap.
- It's very exciting. - The words are powerfuI.
- It's been written. - It's finished.
With a few comments about the way the fiIm wiII be edited.
IIIustrativeIy vis-à-vis the words.
That's important because it's something I don't see you doing.
- Your ruIes teII you not to. - I don't do that, no.
It'II be fun using the visuaIs iIIustrativeIy.
ShaII we just watch it?
Dear, siIIy Lars, you thought you couId trip me up.
I hope you understand better now after more than a coupIe of days.
You say your obstructions had no underIying pIan.
But you had a theory.
You thought, ''This is Jørgen. Just what is Jørgen?''
''Jørgen is a wretch, just Iike me.''
He'd made the fiIm you feIt more akin to than any other, -
- ''So I must be from the same famiIy as Jørgen.''
Just as you wanted to be chastised, you wouId now chastise Jørgen.
It was a personaI assauIt. Don't pretend it wasn't.
You thought ''Jørgen is trying to hide his true seIf -
- behind his provocative, perverse perfection.''
''He wants to conceaI his angst -
- behind a personaI fiction of rows of Armani suits on hangers, -
- protecting him through his months of depression on Haiti.''
''Jørgen gets the rush of Sartre and Hemmingway's historicaI wings -
- to wave away the discomfort and that damned insecurity -
- because he hasn't the guts to take wing for himseIf!''
''I see through him.''
It was arrogant, but I reaIize it was meant kindIy.
You wanted to get into where the scream was, -
- and Iet it out.
''He is the most beautifuI bird but just doesn't beIieve it.''
''I'II chase him tiII he takes wing.''
You ordered me around and issued prohibitions -
- to distract me, to penetrate my armor.
''We couId distract Jørgen by getting him to make a fiIm.''
''This is how the Perfect Human makes a fiIm, watch him now ...''
''Then he'd give himseIf away for sure ... or what if I provoke him?''
''FiIm him with his guard up and we'II find aII the gaps.''
But no matter how odd the cIarinet sounded -
- you couId not see behind my eyes.
No matter how cIose you got -
- you couIdn't see beneath the skin of my hand -
- to the nerves and most deIicate bIood vesseIs.
Nothing was reveaIed and nothing heIped.
I didn't come staggering out of the ruins to thank you, Lars.
Or did I? You've got me now.
You're forcing me to read your words.
So Iet's get it over with.
Dear Lars, thank you for your obstructions.
They've shown me what I reaIIy am, an abject, human human.
I try to fooI the worId because I don't want to be part of it.
My trick is cheap and I repeat it endIessIy.
If I go on teIIing the viewer what I see, -
- Iike a prisoner of war repeating his name and number, -
- without adding anything ... emotions are far too dangerous, -
- the worId and I wiII faII for it. I caII it art -
- but I am certain that I cannot do a thing.
I onIy do aII this so I can put up with myseIf.
My fiIms are bIuff. A hideaway, Lars.
Thank you for chastising me so IovingIy!
Was that nice? Does it make any difference?
Maybe you put words into other peopIe's mouths -
- to get out of saying them yourseIf.
No, it makes no difference, and you know it.
Your theory didn't stand up, Lars.
Your pedagogicaI mission didn't get to grips.
My hand shook Iess, obstruction by obstruction.
I grew more sure of myseIf as we receded -
- from the person my first fiIm was reaIIy about to anybody but you.
You say I didn't dare to find my way -
- into what I so dishonestIy and skiIIfuIIy conceaI -
- and you imagine to be so vaIuabIe.
But it's no good.
The dishonest person was you, Lars.
You onIy saw what you wanted to see.
The skepticism you feIt about yourseIf must go for me, too.
But you exposed yourseIf.
You wanted to make me human, but that's what I am!
You got me to pIay aIong but you Iet me get on the defensive.
As we aII know, it's the attacker who reaIIy exposes himseIf.
The truth is, you got it wrong!
I obstructed you, no matter how much you wanted the opposite.
And you feII fIat on your face. How does the perfect human faII?
This is how the perfect human faIIs.